What happens when women stop whispering about the wounds they carry—and start owning their truth out loud? In this gripping and empowering conversation, Annie Boon joins Sarah to unpack the messy, painful, and often silent struggles around domestic abuse, infidelity, shame, and identity. From founding the Hush Festival to holding space for betrayed wives, mistresses, and survivors alike, Annie shares how real healing begins when we create safe spaces for women to be seen, heard, and held.
“Shame is a silent killer. When you don’t talk about it, it grows.” – Annie Boon
“The Hush Festival isn’t about me. It’s about giving women a place to be seen, heard, and start to heal safely.” – Annie Boon
“If you're holding it all together for someone else while you're falling apart—we see you.” – Sarah Jordan-Ross
Annie Boon is a mindset coach, speaker, and founder of the Hush Festival, a powerful virtual platform helping women share their stories of infidelity, abuse, shame, and healing. Known for her honest, no-BS compassion and deep intuitive guidance, Annie is on a mission to create spaces where women feel safe to speak, feel, and rebuild. She specializes in helping high-performing women navigate betrayal, abuse, and deep personal transformation.
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Let’s keep the conversation going. Because when we talk, shame loses its power.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (00:01) Hey, welcome back to Taboo Talk with Sarah, the podcast that breaks the silence, fosters hope, and talks about the tough stuff so you never feel alone. If you're new here, I'm your host, Sarah Jordan Ross. I am a wife, a mum of three amazing boys. I'm a wellness coach, and I'm your guide through the real, raw stories behind caregiving, chronic illness, burnout, grief.
All those other things that we all go through, but we don't all talk about. And today I'm really excited because I'm sitting down with Annie Boone. Now, Annie is a mindset coach, a speaker, and a powerful voice for living unapologetically. She's passionate about helping women shed the shame, reclaim their confidence, and step boldly into who they really are.
She also brings a deep compassion and insight from her advocacy in the domestic violence space, helping women break free, heal and rebuild their lives. Welcome, I am so so glad you're here.
Annie Boon (01:08)
Thank you. this is wonderful. Thank you so much for that beautiful intro.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (01:13)
You're welcome. So let's start with your story. You've been really open about your own journey, moving through shame and limiting beliefs and learning how to stand unapologetically in your own truth. Can you share with us a little bit about what set you on that path and why you are so passionate about mindset and confidence coaching?
Annie Boon (01:39)
Yeah, I tell you what, it's when you've had an experience and been through things in life that you're able to, you end up with a choice. You either fall apart or you pick up the pieces and you move forward. And a big catalyst for me was my children. There was a point in my life that I think if it weren't for my children, I don't know if I would have chosen to stay here. It got that bad.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (02:09)
Yep. Bye.
Annie Boon (02:09)
and the thing with the relationship...
⁓
Sarah Jordan-Ross (02:13)
Our
kids are quite often our biggest reason why.
Annie Boon (02:18)
Yeah,
absolutely. And it just got so toxic and so damaging to me personally. And I'd always been a confident, outgoing person. And I was listening to a speaker the other day and it just resonated so deeply because it wasn't domestic violence in the beginning. It was domestic abuse. And you can't see that. There's no bruises. People think you are
mad, know, they don't believe you because he is so high standing in the community. And I kept getting threatened as well, that you mustn't forget, you know, I'm the one that's built you to where you are, and I can take it down just as easily. so for a very long time, it was drummed into me that I'm a bad useless person, and I need to be ashamed of myself. And it really does wear you down. And it was a turning point.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (03:14)
Yeah, because you get told
something often enough, you start to believe it.
Annie Boon (03:17)
You believe it?
Absolutely. And eventually the actual turning point, I knew what was going on. I realized and I couldn't talk to anybody. I had always been the one that everyone turns to me for guidance and help. And I thought, how can I show them that I've made a fuck up here? I've chosen badly and I can't even acknowledge it to anyone because of...
the status he held at the time and because people were looking up to me as a role model and here I'm in this horrible relationship and I can do nothing about it. And I thought to myself, after I got out of that relationship, I thought to myself, I never want to be in a position like that ever again and I don't want other people to be in position where they don't know who to turn to. And in particular,
⁓ At the moment, the work that I have been doing the past year has been with women in high-power positions because it is that much more damaging. You know, that saying, higher you are, the harder you fall. Yeah. And they won't speak up. They won't reach out. So a lot of my work is highly confidential. The one on work, one work that I do, I pride myself on, on keeping exactly that safe container for her to talk.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (04:28)
It's true.
Annie Boon (04:44)
And a lot of the time, that's all it takes to get the first step going. They open up, they talk, they release. And once they're seen and heard, they can see the bigger picture of, my God, it's worse than I even thought. When they verbalize it to them, to somebody else and hear it, then they realize just how, gotta get away now. And then we formulate a plan, an exit strategy, which can be as simple as,
You know, you need to leave the guy. But in some instances, we've got to go covert and create an escape route for her, where you literally plan this months in advance and you've got to blindside him. Because sometimes it is that... It's scary for some of them. It really is. So, yeah.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (05:19)
Mm.
And they do
say that the most dangerous time for a woman in that situation is when she leaves. it's great that you help put those supports in place for when she does make that break so that she can do it safely. yeah, because scarily, so many women don't ever take that step or
Annie Boon (05:41)
Yeah.
Yeah.
and feel strong in doing it.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (06:02)
they do and then it has disastrous consequences.
Annie Boon (06:06)
does, yeah. And do you know what, it's funny because I always joke that I've got this secret weapon in that a lot of my life ⁓ was very male dominated from my childhood, my best friends, my colleagues. My first job was a very masculine environment. When I got involved in aviation and the air shows, it's all this masculine energy. And I became one of the boys and...
you get inside their mind and you know how they think. And ⁓ especially with the work that I do with women that have been caught in the web of infidelity, I help a lot being able to show them how the male psyche is working in this situation. Because often, you know, one thing leads to another. what I have found is that with the infidelity, depending on the kind of person that has, you know, the kind of person that has cheated, done the cheating.
The outcome can go so many different ways. And once you can get inside that person's mind and think ahead, one step ahead, what would this character do? There's a lot you can avert and extricate yourself or mend. If you understand the male psychology, I say that on purpose because that's that side of the business that I talk and I work with all the women.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (07:35)
You do lots of amazing work and at the moment you're right in the middle of co-hosting the Hush Festival as we record this and that really feels to me like it's a bit of an extension of everything that you stand for and the work that you've been doing for a while of creating those...
Annie Boon (07:37)
I love it.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (08:01)
safe spaces for people to show up fully as who they are and also to have those conversations around infidelity, around domestic violence, living authentically and recognizing when you're not and then making those shifts. So do you want to tell us a bit about the Hush Festival and
Annie Boon (08:17)
peace.
Thank you.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (08:28)
why you decided to start that?
Annie Boon (08:32)
tell you why is ⁓ it actually was a funny story that kind of was a catalyst. There was a woman reaching out to me in my DMs and she was definitely with a narcissistic ⁓ partner and she knew this but she didn't know how to get away from it and she said she didn't have the money to invest in a you know one-on-one and I thought how can I help this woman and
Eventually I put together a small container and I thought to gate keep it. I would put a small price tag on it. I think it was something silly like seven dollars and Nobody came forward and I was like These women need help, but nobody's coming forward. What what is the missing ingredient here? And I just you know, I sort of left it
But the thing on my heart was these women need a platform. They need somewhere that they can be seen and heard because a lot of the time that's when the healing starts. It's cathartic when you can stand up and say, this is my story, but you need to know that you're in a safe space. And then the penny dropped for me. I remember a time in my life where I was under such control that my every move was being
observed, was being watched, was being controlled. Now can you imagine you want to come to a safe space where you can share your story or just listen to other stories so that you can learn and not feel alone and you go ahead and you order your little ticket to go to this festival and it comes up on your bank statement you spend X amount to go to Hush and people won't realize
what kind of ⁓ a red flag that will be to a controlling person when they see that come through on their bank statement what the hell is this why are you going so these women are too terrified to make a move where they will be seen so i thought i've got to make it in such a way that there is no ⁓ barrier to entry no barrier i want women to be able to come in there and not be shit scared that somebody's going to find out they're there
So that was the first thinking. And I decided for that reason, and against all my coaches and all my support, my mentors, are you bloody crazy? And I'm like, this is not about me. This is about a woman's fucking life. They didn't get it. And eventually I opened it up and I didn't expect much. literally, it was two weeks from the thought to actually launching it. That was in March this year. And I thought,
if one person comes in and if one person speaks, I'll be happy. on the two days before we actually launched it, there was nobody in the group. I thought, ⁓ and suddenly, slowly but surely, by the time I opened the doors, we had 30 people in the group. And then through the week, the woman started saying, I would like to talk about my story. And it led to another and another. And suddenly we had
I wasn't even keeping up with the number of talks that women wanted to give and they varied so much from infidelity to ⁓ sexuality to domestic violence, narcissistic control. ⁓ And I thought I've got to balance this out somehow. So I reached out to a few friends to talk about other topics. So I had an image consultant come in to teach about body conscious and
confidence and then I had a woman who she's a hairdresser but she talks about how your hair can impact you and you know so I started putting in little fun topics in between and the next thing more women were coming and saying I want to listen to that talk about the image consulting meanwhile she needed to hear a different story but now she had a cover as to why she was in the group and that is how this evolved and what's been such a gift for me is that
Sarah Jordan-Ross (12:35)
Yes.
Annie Boon (12:41)
I've had speakers I've approached and said, would you like to come and talk? you know, for certain speakers, for the speakers themselves, I put a fee for them to talk because I needed some way to keep this container going. I literally shut down my business for two weeks, you know, and a lot of women stepped forward. A lot of women turned around and had the attitude of...
I'm sorry, I don't pay to speak. On principle, I don't pay to speak. And I was like, this is for other women. You've got this expertise that you could be sharing for someone who needs it, you know? And then on the other side of the coin, I've got women who normally stand on stages commanding thousands to do talks that have actually reached out to me and said, would you be okay with me coming in to do a talk? And I'm like, would I be okay?
Sarah Jordan-Ross (13:36)
That's a silly question. ⁓
Annie Boon (13:37)
Yes! Yeah
and I suddenly realized these are my people. They get it. They get the whole essence of what Hush is about. It's about supporting women who need support where they are in their lives right now and just coming together as a community and keeping it safe. I really gatekeep. Nobody gets in there without either being referred by somebody.
or filling in the little question things before they get in the door. And I have, in case that's your next question, yes I have, turned people away. I blocked a ostensibly a woman, ⁓ who created what I think was a fake page, a Facebook page, ⁓ no history, nothing, and I just blocked her completely from the group. And then there was another girl that wanted to come in, and I go and do a little checkup on who they are.
And on her Facebook page, she was traumatized. And I thought, she's not ready. You could see on her page that she was not in a place of healing. And I want Hush to be a place of healing, where you understand you're in this place. She was still very much in the middle of it. And I thought, no, I'm not a trained therapist. I don't ever want to be seen as a therapist. And she I saw as someone needing to do therapy first.
I know my lane. I know my lane. I'm there to help women. I'm there to share my experiences, to help women and to mentor. But yeah, I know we're not across the line. So yeah, very safe container.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (15:16)
Yes.
And we need to know when to not cross that line, when to not push the boundaries. Sometimes some boundaries need pushing, but there's others that no, they need to be forced. And you really need to make sure that you do keep it that safe space because
Annie Boon (15:29)
So yeah.
Yeah.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (15:41)
you are dealing with women who are going through traumatic experiences who are in a very difficult place in their life and you want to create that safe container for them to to heal but you don't want to run the risk of getting them in there when they're not ready and making the the bad situation worse so well done for recognizing your limitations
Annie Boon (15:51)
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
crossing the line.
worse. Thank you.
You know, when I see my role as a mentor, a guide, an intuitive, I know that I'm good at that. And I've studied psychology, I've studied neuroscience, I've studied so many things, but it is not my lane. I don't do therapy. I can help you. I can guide you to find your own answers.
but I'm certainly not going to sit there and pretend that I'm something I'm not. Which is a problem in the coaching industry. There are a lot of people out there, I was mortified the one time, there was a woman who was doing some sales pitch on her page that she's a relationship expert dealing in ⁓ domestic marriages that are falling apart and...
you know, and she called herself a relationship expert. And when I went and looked on her page, she had just qualified, she was 23 years old. And I was like, how dare you? How dare you? For me, an expert doesn't have to be someone who's qualified, but it certainly has to be somebody who has the experience, the knowledge and the wherewithal to handle that. And I just thought, and there are so many out there doing that.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (17:12)
Sorry.
Annie Boon (17:31)
And they, ⁓ it's more damaging than good. It's mad.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (17:35)
in some
ways because they haven't figured out yet that or that they don't know what it is that they don't know yet and when we're young and we haven't been through as much of of life we do think we're 10 foot tall bulletproof and know everything unfortunately life generally knocks that out of us or
Annie Boon (17:45)
Yeah,
Yeah.
Yep.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (18:05)
Because all we have that experience where the more that we learn, the more that we grow, the more we realize we don't know much. Pretty much. So I've been a massage therapist for 25 years and studied the body extensively like you. I've studied psychology. I've studied neuropsychology of background in bioscience.
Annie Boon (18:12)
We know F all. I learn every day.
So, yeah.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (18:33)
But the more I learn about the body over these 25 years, the more I've realized I know nothing. And that's because the whole field of, what we're learning, it is constantly growing. We're constantly learning more. And we realize, ⁓ how I thought about that. This little piece of information changes that. So it's.
Annie Boon (18:38)
Mm-hmm.
developing.
Yep, totally.
And I mean, even now with the trained therapists, for them to be keeping up with the modern, not even modern, the new things that keep coming that are getting better and better and better. There's a thing, compassionate inquiry, which is a different form of therapy. you know, there's so many different modules and also it's becoming so
Sarah Jordan-Ross (19:23)
things like.
Annie Boon (19:26)
diverse that as a client of a therapist, you've got so many choices now as to which ⁓ professional you'll go to because they are now able to not just say, I'm a psychologist or a psychiatrist. They've got specialties now and you know, like you said, it is evolving so quickly and you've got to keep up with it.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (19:46)
because we're realizing more and more that people don't fit into nice neat little boxes. There is no one size fits all approach for anything. And so many people in our world are either in chronic fight or flight. They have trauma experiences that then color how they see the world and
Annie Boon (19:58)
Mm-hmm.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (20:14)
For a therapist really to be able to help them, they need to know the effects that trauma can have and that it is going to be different from one person to another.
Annie Boon (20:26)
Yeah, totally. And you know, for me...
Sarah Jordan-Ross (20:28)
So that's the,
find that right person to help you.
Annie Boon (20:33)
Yeah. And you know, for me, I find my starting point with most of my people that come to me is shame. Shame is a huge, I want to call it, I'll say it as what I think of shame. Shame is a silent killer. And it's one thing to carry shame about yourself, but it's another thing to be shamed because
Sarah Jordan-Ross (20:52)
would agree.
Annie Boon (21:01)
that is even 20 times worse. And often when I get asked how can I work with, for example, mistresses, women, the other woman, okay. And I often sit there and I think to myself, try and picture how this woman's feeling. She is branded immediately, okay, ⁓ as this bad person. And yes, there are some like that. Absolutely there are. But the majority of them have been
reeled in by a narcissistic personality. It's all about his ego. And she then gets caught in this little web. Not only when it comes out, not only is she ashamed that she's done this, but she carries a double shame because she's let down her sisterhood. She's done something that all women don't want to happen in their relationships. And then, so that's her double shame. Likewise with the betrayed wife.
Everyone thinks the betrayed wife, you know, what shame could she possibly carry, you know? And they don't see that the biggest shame of all for the ⁓ betrayed wife is that first of all, she's normally the last to know. And can you imagine how that must feel afterwards when you find out that your husband's been having an affair and everybody else knew or had a suspicion and nobody came and told you?
And then you start questioning yourself, was I not good enough? What is wrong with me? And you know, so you've got the mistress here, the betrayed wife here, they're both carrying this immense amount of shame. You've got the guy and I talk of the love triangle from my perspective as a woman. I know that women also have affairs and they could be that triangle, but for me, the work I do, it's the man is the common denominator. And you've got the two women pitted against each other.
He gets a slap on the knuckles, one of his mates pats him on the back and goes, ha ha, how did you get away with it for so long? And these two women's lives are destroyed. And they hate each other. Why? So I took a big risk a couple of years ago and I've done it a handful of times since. It takes a certain type of person who can do it. I bring together a mistress and a betrayed wife and let them have a conversation.
But it's that mistress and that betrayed wife. I won't use, that's too close. Yeah, yeah. I've done that one once and it worked beautifully. But they were both mature minded women. But if you get a mistress and a betrayed wife and you put them together in a room and let them, and I'm immediate, know, we have a discussion, it's a conversation.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (23:37)
That's just too explosive, ⁓
Annie Boon (23:56)
And when they each get into each other's minds and shoes and you see the healing, it sounds ludicrous, it sounds opposite to what you would want to possibly do and often it is. But the amount of healing and understanding that comes from that conversation, it's mind blowing because you suddenly realize, wow, I didn't know that and he lied to me about that. And suddenly everything starts, you know, and then the women's, in particular, the betrayed wife.
starts realizing it wasn't about her and her failure as a partner. So that's one of the fun conversations I have along the way.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (24:33)
about him.
You
And
I wonder how often in those conversations does it happen that those two women realize that they have far more in common and far more that connects them than they do differences and things that divide them and bringing them together provides that way for them both to heal and to say that the other woman doesn't have to be
Annie Boon (25:04)
Yep. Actually, the one.
Mm-hmm. Yeah. And often she is a victim herself. You know? And it happens so easily. And in particular, it's in the work environment. Often it'll happen in the work environment where you've got a more powerful person, you know, that puts this younger person on a pedestal and tells her, you know, she's everything to him and she lights him up and, it's so terrible at home and...
Sarah Jordan-Ross (25:12)
an enemy.
Mm.
Yeah.
Annie Boon (25:40)
The job is
stressing him and all of this. And of course, you know, she's all lit up and wow, you know, this guy really likes me. And oftentimes they won't even know the guy's married. And that's terrible. I mean, there was a situation that I helped with where the husband was a traveling salesman. So of course he, the wife was used to him traveling from country to country and he actually had two families.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (25:51)
Mmm.
Annie Boon (26:09)
and the mistress thought she was his girlfriend and the wife thought she was the only one and it was only when this I can't remember what transpired that he went back to the town where his wife was living and something had gone wrong with one of his children in his other family that though that we will call her the mistress for now but she didn't know she was that she eventually got on an airplane because she knew he was going to be in that town somewhere and she the mistress bust him with the wife ⁓
Okay.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (26:41)
usually happen that way around.
Annie Boon (26:43)
Yeah. But she did not know, she had no, no idea that he was married. Absolutely no idea. And the healing that came from those two women talking, that's one of those, one of the two instances that I personally was involved with the actual mistress and the actual wife. ⁓ Yeah, you know, of course the hurt was there and the pain, but when the two of them could see that both of them had been deeply damaged by one man.
⁓ They are now friends, funny enough. Friends. Like, you know, it is doable, but you've got to be able to hold compassion and you've got to be able to try and get into somebody else's shoes and see them as a human being, not as a ⁓ horrible little whore over there and a useless wife who obviously couldn't keep him happy in bed and, know. ⁓ And, yeah.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (27:38)
things we tell ourselves.
Annie Boon (27:41)
And the biggest thing ⁓ with infidelity that where women think it's all about sex and it's far from it. It's far from it. Yes, of course, in the beginning it would be part of it. But I think the biggest ⁓ betrayal is not the physical betrayal. It's when, yeah, that emotional connection. So that's why I'll say,
Sarah Jordan-Ross (28:04)
emotional.
Annie Boon (28:10)
But we only did it once or twice or whatever, but there's this emotional connection and often he's sharing stuff with his mistress that he would never ever share with his wife. That is one of the biggest betrayals. It's like this, and that is when the infidelity is where that is dangerous. Not so much, it doesn't start in bedrooms. It starts here and here.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (28:41)
That's the thing we sometimes forget. So in that situation and in the other domestic violence situations that you work in, what do you wish more people understood? Whether they're survivors or they want to support somebody who's in that situation.
Annie Boon (28:41)
Yeah.
and
Mm.
I would say that I wish that more people would just have more open conversations about domestic abuse, domestic violence, infidelity. That's why I love your program, because it's like, we talk about the things that people don't want to talk about. the only way you learn about something, yeah! The only way you learn about something,
Sarah Jordan-Ross (29:24)
lots of fun doing it.
Annie Boon (29:30)
is if you're willing to listen and hear and be exposed to and I think if more women were willing to stand up and share their stories, they would realize first of all, they are not alone. They would also have this knock on effect of being ⁓ a lighthouse for other women in the same position because when you are being domestically abused or
you know, you've been betrayed, you really, really feel alone. And it's the kind of stuff that back in the day, it should have been hush-hush, you people didn't talk about it. But in this day and age where you can talk about almost anything, I mean, we've got the internet and people talk openly about and they welcome different types of people into their communities. And yes, you know, when it comes to domestic abuse and infidelity, people still
Sarah Jordan-Ross (30:27)
We still
go like this.
Annie Boon (30:28)
Don't really
talk. Yeah. Look the other way. ⁓ If you hear your neighbor screaming, how many people actually sit up and pay attention? Think about it. I know I would, but I live in a little town where everybody minds everybody else's business. But you hear of people that say, yeah, I know I heard them screaming and shouting. And three weeks later, this woman's worst case scenario, dead.
But people don't want to get involved. And the thing is, if you don't want to get involved physically, what you can do is just let them know you're there for them. And one of the things I teach is to get a code word. So if you've got a close friend and you're about to get into a relationship, before you get into that relationship, you know, we used to do this stupid thing when we used to go on blind dates.
if the date's not going well, phone me and I'll give you an excuse to come home, you know, kind of thing. Similar concept is if you are in a dire situation, it would be so good if you could have some sort of code speak that you could let your friend know that you are not in a good place. Some shit has gone down, but you can't talk about it. So that she can keep an eye out because
Sarah Jordan-Ross (31:47)
Hmm.
Annie Boon (31:52)
Sometimes you want somebody to know, please have my back, but you don't want to give them the story. And if we could actually say, here's my little code for shit's going down. Please don't get involved, but keep an eye out for me. You suddenly don't feel alone. And I've used that, you know, I use that a lot with the ladies I work with, that they find one person. You just need one person. That's all you need. That you have let them know, you don't have to give them your story.
You just let them know shit's going down. I don't want to tell you my story. Just know if I need you, come. You know, kind of thing.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (32:31)
But if you
hear me say that or you see me do a particular thing that you know that's my I'm in trouble help me and We all need that one person I know on an earlier episode had Misty Kerrigan on and Misty does a lot of work with Homeless youth and at-risk kids
Annie Boon (32:37)
Yeah? Yeah. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (32:59)
And she
Annie Boon (33:00)
Yeah.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (33:00)
said an amazing thing and it was that one adult who cares about a child can make the hugest difference in their life. That all it takes is one person. And that's the same for all of us. We just need that one person who we can say, stuff's going on. That one person who we can say,
Annie Boon (33:22)
and a big
Sarah Jordan-Ross (33:24)
I'm in this situation, I need you to have my back and that we can know that that's all we have to say.
Annie Boon (33:31)
Yeah, exactly, exactly. You don't have to go into detail. You don't have to share the whole, you know, nitty gritties, but to know that somebody else knows you're not okay. It just is a lifeline because when you feel all alone, the worst case scenarios come to light. And I've seen it a few times and it's so sad that if they just had one person they could have reached out to.
could have had a different outcome completely. But to be shamed and feeling ashamed and to be afraid, it's not easy. It's not easy to reach out. So I've taught my kids from young that if they ever, and my kids are now grown, my youngest, the twins are now 21, so they're young adults now, but I taught them from very small, if ever you get into trouble,
Make me your first phone call. No questions asked. I'll be there. And maybe tomorrow when we wake up, I might crap all over you. We might have a good sit down and talk. But in that moment, when the shit's going down, you pick up that phone and you phone me. And they've done it. And I had to have a giggle the other day. My one son, who's now 31, got himself into a little pickle. And actually it was such a stupid little pickle. And
at 31 years of age picked up the phone and said, mom, it's one of those phone calls. No questions asked. I said, go for it, you know, and helped him through his little issue. And afterwards, the next day he phoned me and he said, I feel so stupid that I did that. But it was such a relief knowing that you were there for me and that he says you really didn't ask me any questions. And that's the point. You want to be there because the moment you aren't there in that way with your own kids.
they go to somebody else or they don't go to anybody at all. And I'd far rather my kids came to me and said, mom, I fucked up. Can you help me? As opposed to being the last to know or, you know, finding your child in huge trouble because he was too scared to come and talk to you. So a lot of this, the way I'm talking about it is a lot of this should start with us as parents trying to show our kids, male or female,
Don't be afraid to reach out to one person, just one, and find that one person.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (36:00)
and yeah, find that one person, find your tribe, find that place where you are safe, where you are connected, where you do belong. We all need that space where we can just go blah when we need to and know that somebody's gonna get it and that also if you need it,
Annie Boon (36:15)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (36:25)
There's
going to be somebody there that will pick you up, dust you off and say, hey, what do you need?
Annie Boon (36:30)
Yeah, exactly. I always say it's one of the worst things for me and maybe because I'm such an empath and I carry a lot of compassion, in my younger days it was an absolute curse for me but I've learned to harness it and for me I can never understand when another person is down why others have to kick that person still. So that's where my mind goes immediately. You're the shit. Why would you...
want to make that person feel even worse by going, you're a bloody arsehole. How could you have an affair with a married man? How could you get involved with a narcissist? How could you help? You're not helping the situation. Exactly, you know, so just be there for the person. Don't have to knock them. You can think a million thoughts in your head, but don't knock it. Yeah, just fucking be there.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (37:07)
They're already feeling bad enough.
don't have to say it.
I quite often think that a whole bunch of people need to re-watch Bambi. If you can't say something nice, please keep your stupid mouth shut.
Annie Boon (37:29)
YEEEE END
Exactly, exactly. Oh, you know, there's just, we need more compassion, we need more kindness, and we need more understanding of other people's situations. Because the day shit goes down in your life is the day you're going to realize maybe I should have listened. And I had a very interesting discussion about a year ago, I was doing a Q &A and
Sarah Jordan-Ross (37:55)
Mmm.
Annie Boon (38:05)
One woman was quite intrigued about the whole infidelity side of things and I said that I thought part of the pre-marriage ⁓ coaching, whatever you want to call it, should be you sit down and you talk to each other about what would happen if one of us, you know, betrayed the other because then you kind of have an idea of, you know, but then again when you're young, you know, you're both sitting there go, no, no, So she said, we're fine.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (38:32)
never happen?
Annie Boon (38:35)
And eventually this woman pushed me and she said to me, but how do I know if my friend's husband is having an affair? Do I tell her or don't I? So I said, now that's a good question. Some women want to know, other women don't. So what you need to do is next time you have a dinner party with friends, with your close friends, you're at the table and you bring up the topic of, and I said, use me as an example.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (38:49)
That is a good question.
Annie Boon (39:05)
heard this crazy bitch on the radio the other day talking about infidelity and how some people behave this way and that way and what do you guys think? And slowly the conversation will go around the table where you can hear from your friend herself who says, if my husband ever had an affair, I don't want to know. Then you know. Okay. And the other one might say, if you don't tell me, I'll hate you for the rest of my life. Then you know. So it...
Again, it comes back to these open conversations. Have your book club. Gee, I heard this stupid woman talking about, you know, what would you do if your friend cheated? It's a simple conversation. And you will then find out very quickly how you can help your friend when shit does go down or how you would like to be helped when shit goes down. Because they really are. There are some women who don't want to know. They don't. And I've seen. Absolutely.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (39:59)
and they're gonna shoot the messenger.
Annie Boon (40:03)
There was a very sad situation where it was actually the men who confronted the guy who was cheating on his wife. And they said, they weren't married. It was his common-law wife, you know. But they'd been together for over a decade. And she knew he had a wandering eye, but she loved him. She absolutely loved him. And he was so good to her. And his little group of friends said, listen, dude, if you don't go and tell her, you know.
We're going to tell it. You better go and sort this out. It's not right. So he took their advice. Not only did it break them up because this man felt so bad. So he broke up what was actually a functional, loving relationship because his friends told him this is what she will want. It was completely opposite of what she wanted. And as a result, she turned on all his friends and
They thought she was going to come to them and go, Sayo, thank you so much for sorting him out. She hated them because they destroyed her little happy bubble. You know, she had predicted. Yeah, and she knew, she knew that he had a roaming eye, but because she loved him so much and their home life was happy, she didn't want to know. And that's where you've to be able to find out how your friend feels about this shit before you go and...
Sarah Jordan-Ross (41:10)
They blew up her life and she was not...
Mm.
Annie Boon (41:30)
blow up her life or before you don't blow up her life when she actually needs you to have a conversation. Have a fucking conversation.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (41:42)
That's the thing, we need to have more conversations around those difficult things that so many of us go through but we just don't talk about it. And anyone who's watched the show has heard me say it before. That was the whole reason why I started this show was that as a massage therapist I was hearing similar stories from people generally.
Annie Boon (41:47)
Mm-hmm.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (42:11)
⁓ mums of kids with extra needs and the challenges that that brings. And then I was dropping my son off somewhere and I was driving home and a song I hadn't heard for years came on the radio. And while it is a song about suicide, the thing that struck me most in that song is one line that says, nobody ever knew how much she blamed herself.
So, so often in life we go through experiences but nobody knows how we really feel about them because we don't talk about it. And I know a lot of Brené Brown's work too. Shame dies when light is brought to the situation. So we need to have those conversations and we need to actually ask those questions because, yeah.
Annie Boon (42:50)
We don't.
Yeah, love you Rick.
Yep, absolutely.
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
And suicide, that's another topic. ⁓ Yeah, carry on.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (43:12)
in your example the sorry
yeah I gonna say in your example yeah know if the friend that you're talking about is the one who is going to thank you for intervening or is going to say hey I knew I wished I didn't know but you really didn't need to go do that because yeah we are all all different
Annie Boon (43:29)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, exactly.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (43:42)
And there'll
be times where a situation may not be ideal but it's not horrible either. So it's knowing where that sits. ⁓ It's really easy to judge from outside.
Annie Boon (43:51)
And it's not your situation. It's not your situation to judge.
It's not your place to judge it. You know, it might not be what you would like. And that's the other thing with the whole shame. And I'm glad you touched on suicide because ⁓ this coming Wednesday, the 10th of September, it's National, ⁓ sorry, World Suicide Prevention Day, just creating awareness around it.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (44:03)
Mm.
Mmm.
Annie Boon (44:21)
And again, in the line of work that I do, there's a fair amount of suicide and attempted suicide because of not having anyone to talk to and nobody realizing how bad it had gotten. And you'll often find if somebody's taken their life, you sit there and go, but why? I never knew they were, you know, they didn't have anyone to talk to. Nobody knew, you know?
Sarah Jordan-Ross (44:49)
And we need to make it easier for people to say when something's not right. We need to create those spaces. So you've built your coaching practice, you've done the Hush Festival. What's next for you?
Annie Boon (44:55)
Yeah.
Well, first of all, I love Hush. Every time I run it, I can feel it. It really fills my heart. know, it's one of those, I get excited. I mean, right now it's 2.30 in the morning. I'm wide awake because my energy is off the charts because I've just come out of the first day. And what I want to do with this is just, you know, I don't want it to explode. I don't want a massive group because then you lose that intimacy. I want to do more.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (45:12)
It's a great name too.
Annie Boon (45:40)
focused work on little pockets of women, helping them to grow little pockets together where they can support one another. know, so for some strange reason, I never pick a theme for Hush. But the theme running through Hush this time is domestic violence, not just domestic abuse, like violence. And I would love to afterwards create a small pocket of women who
have got similar things that have been hurting them, harming them, shaming them, making them afraid. And then be able to work with them in smaller pockets that they can release the shame, let go of the fear, and then just shine from there. Because those are the two big, big problems, is the shame and the fear around your particular situation, many situations. Sometimes situations that you or I might think are,
It's no big deal, you know. ⁓ Might be something huge in somebody else's life. A young girl who gets straight A's at school flunks an exam and takes her life. I had that when I was in Matric in the final year of school. She didn't want to face her parents. And for her, that was the end of the world.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (46:52)
It's the end of the world.
Annie Boon (47:06)
It was a fucking exam she failed. It shouldn't have mattered. But for her, it was too much, too much. And the shame and the fear of facing her father pushed her over the edge. So for me, my biggest mission in life is to start the conversations, to create understanding, and then to create containers where women can actually release the shame, release the fear, and just start.
believing in themselves again. And that's going to be more and more of the work that I'm going to be doing. So I'm super excited about that going forward.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (47:43)
I can't wait to see what you will do. And as much as you and I could stay here and talk all day, I don't know that everybody else would like to stay on here for hours on end, but I know I would love to get you back on in future episodes to explore all of these things a little bit more.
Annie Boon (47:51)
Exactly.
I could.
would be the same.
would be awesome, would be awesome. Thank
Sarah Jordan-Ross (48:14)
Never know,
we might even get a group of women together to talk about it and have a conversation around the table. If that's something that people who are listening would love to see happen, please drop me a note in the comments or send me a message and let me know. Yes, I want to see conversations around the table and I will make it happen.
Annie Boon (48:20)
Yeah, it would be awesome. It's a good idea. Yeah.
I think that's a brilliant idea.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (48:44)
that yeah
yeah we need to have those those conversations and those different perspectives too because we've we all go through different things that that shape us and and define us but they don't have to continue to affect us so our past may shape us but it doesn't have to define who we are and
Annie Boon (49:01)
and
Love that.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (49:14)
our experiences, if you get, I sometimes think if you get a group of people together who've been through something similar
Annie Boon (49:23)
Mm-hmm.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (49:24)
And you find that common ground, that common way of seeing things, the way that while people are connected, then what divides them and makes them different, that's when we start to see change because we can say, these are the things that really helped us. These are the things that really didn't. So we need to do more of one and way less of the other.
Annie Boon (49:48)
Yeah, exactly. And to do it in a way that is supportive, ⁓ because you can often get a group of people, women in particular, getting together and doing what I call husband bashing, where they sit and they just... And they achieve nothing except venting. So it's got to be, you know, for example, you holding a round table and having these kinds of discussions. It's so important to keep it upbeat and on track.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (49:53)
Mmm.
We get a bit competitive.
Annie Boon (50:17)
Yeah, sounds awesome.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (50:19)
So before we finish up, I just want to thank you for being here today and for the way that you show up as fully authentically who you are and how you share the experiences that you've been through and how the work that you're doing is helping people who have been in those spaces find hope and healing.
And for everyone listening, really hope that this conversation reminds you that you're not alone. You're not broken. You're becoming who you are. And if you've ever walked through seasons similar to what we've spoken about, we see you.
If you've been holding it all together for somebody else while you're falling apart
Annie Boon (51:06)
and represent.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (51:13)
We see it, we know it. You don't have to do it all alone anymore.
Annie Boon (51:16)
We feel it.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (51:19)
If you're learning to honour that hard stuff and still holding on to joy, and Annie's a great example of that, she spends a lot of time talking about really tough stuff, and yet she's one of the most fun people I know.
Annie Boon (51:39)
Thank you. That's how I keep my sanity.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (51:44)
You need to and you need to be able to let all that stuff go when it's no longer helping you be who you are.
Annie Boon (51:57)
Absolutely. And I honor the work that you do and the brave conversations that you have. ⁓ This has been one of my most fun, uplifting, open interviews and discussions. I just love this kind of thing. So thank you. Thank you for inviting me to be a part of this special place. I love it. You and your dragon.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (52:22)
Yes!
Annie Boon (52:24)
⁓
Sarah Jordan-Ross (52:27)
I think her dragons are really great symbol to go with Taboo talk in that well originally I was gonna call the show shit we don't talk about but that name was already taken so then I started thinking all right what's that stuff we don't talk about what's it called yeah Taboo and as I told you before we started today I've had a thing for dragons since I was young but dragons are very wise
Annie Boon (52:31)
love it
Mm-hmm.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (52:56)
They're very strong. They've seen a lot. They know a lot. And they're quite open in telling it how it is. So, yes. And we all need that. That encouragement and protection that will allow us to move forward into the world. So that's why I have my little dragon whispering in my ear and sitting on my shoulder.
Annie Boon (53:06)
And they are protectors.
He's gorgeous.
And that's why I've always got feathers around me. You will have seen I moved these feathers out the way. Where they're here. I'm not getting them in. Feathers are my symbol. It's about freedom. Feathers symbolize freedom and liberation. yeah.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (53:34)
Yeah.
Yes.
and we all
need a little bit of that.
Annie Boon (53:43)
Yep, we do. ⁓ This has been absolutely awesome. Sarah, thank you so, much for having me. It's been an honor being here. Thank you.
Sarah Jordan-Ross (53:54)
Thank you, thank you for joining me. And for everyone else, everyone listening, let's keep living like it matters. Make every day a special day. Have those conversations so that we can carry that hard-won wisdom forward in how we love, how we serve, how we show up for one another. Thank you for being with us today.
I'm Sarah Jordan Ross, this has been taboo Talk and until next time, remember, your story matters so share it. Because you never know when it's your story that will be the one that changes someone else's.